On Edwards, why Kos is wrong, and why Clinton won't win

Recently,on October 14th, I had the opportunity to meet and interview John Edwards and get to see him speak to a small audience in North Carolina. Some of the notable points of the evening were the following.
First, the Lieberman Kyl bill had just been voted on by the Senate, and Edwards was already going on the offensive on Clinton's vote in support of that bill.
At that point, there had been no threats or sanctions by Bush or Cheney, yet Edwards was already ahead of the curve on the danger of supporting this bill. Now Iowa voters are catching on, and are even booing Clinton at Iowa rallies for this vote.

At issue: Clinton's vote in support of a recent Senate amendment. And this time Edwards' criticism stirred some clear anti-Clinton sentiment.
The amendment–sponsored by Sens. Joe Lieberman, I-Connecticut, and Jon Kyl, R-Arizona–calls for labeling the Iranian Revolutionary Guard a terrorist organization. The former North Carolina senator first commended senators Joe Biden, D-Delaware, and Chris Dodd, D-Connecticut, for voting against it, but he then added, "Sen. Clinton voted 'yes.'"
That statement was followed by an immediate round of booing.
Edwards claims the amendment would "pave the way for Bush to continue to march forward on Iran."
"I didn't understand it," Edwards said. "And then I saw a story in the New York Times [that] quoted some of her supporters explaining why she did it, and the explanation was–I want to get this right–that she was moving from primary mode to general election mode."
A New York Times article from October 14 claimed Clinton's backers have said privately that she is now switching to general election mode, which would imply she's running as the presumptive nominee.

That prompted one supporter to shout, "Like hell!"

It seems like people in Iowa, like the people I saw this weekend at the War protest, are not comfortable with someone who is going to vote for more war. And whether it was Senator Clinton's intention to embolden Bush to push for more aggressive actions towards Iran or not, DOES NOT MATTER. What matters is that she is voting with the neo cons for pro war bills when she should be joining Dodd on the FISA fillibuster, or HOW ABOUT INTRODUCING BILLS TO END THE WAR? It doesn't matter if they will get the 60 votes or not, it will at least get the focus off of Bills to censure Pete Stark and Move On and away from Bills like Lieberman Kyl.
At a political meeting, this week I had a former Republican who still in touch with his old friends tell me that one of his associates had been approached about BEING SELECTED FOR THE NEW DRAFT BOARD.

At the war protests, I actually had Ron Paul activists tell me that Ron Paul is the true anti-war candidate, because Clinton is supporting Bush.
That is right, Clinton's vote is being interpreted as the Democratic agenda, because she is the 'frontrunner.' I say no thank you to that.

As for why Kos is wrong, when Edwards took public financing, Kos said it was 'dangerous' to support Edwards, because he wouldn't have the money that other candidates (like Clinton) would have.
All along, I have maintained, as others have from our collective experience with the Kerry-Edwards campaign, you can have all the money in the world, but if you don't have ideas and leadership, you won't win.

Question - For the bloggers out there, some people have said taking public finance is a bad thing, what do you have to say about public finance?

A - It is very hard to say you are for public finance and then reject it. It is a matter of principle. I have plenty of money to run my campaign. I think we need to have an election not an auction.
Who raises the most money does not make the best president.

part 1


I think what makes a good president is having the ideas and the capacity to lead.

That is what made the most sense to me. What matters more - Hillary Clinton's money or her decision to support Lieberman Kyl and emboldened the neocons?
I don't care if every poll in the nation says Hillary is going to be the president, votes like that and her dismissive attitude to us, the actual democratic voters... is what should matter to us more.

Rolph was surrounded by reporters and said he felt the need to stand his ground when Clinton challenged him: "She tried to ... accuse me of using someone else's words and being stupid. And that offended me. I felt the need to defend myself in view of that kind of comment."

(It is interesting to note, that John did not know I was interviewing him at first, and if you watch, as he approaches me, he is just a genuinely concerned person and that does not change even after he knows he is on camera.)

More from Edwards on the folly of aligning with the Neo-cons:

I believe this war in Iraq needs to be brought to an end, that means an end to combat missions in Iraq. Senator Clinton believes we should continue combat missions in Iraq.
Her explanation for this is that there terrorists are operating in Iraq. That sounds strangely familiar to me. We have a president who says the same thing.

This is an argument between more war and less war. I want the argument (in the debates against the republican in the general) to war versus no war.

On Lieberman Kyl:

You can guess who wants the Iranian Guard designated a terrorist organization? George Bush.
Biden and Dodd, to their credit, voted no. I was strongly opposed to it.
How long does it take us to learn our lesson about George Bush?
You give this guy an inch, he will take a mile.
Senator Clinton voted Yes,
What I am worried about - so in 6 months when George Bush invades Iran, are going to hear (her say)
"if I only knew then what I know now."

On changing the world for the better and to build goodwill:

Instead of 500 billion in Iraq, we could give primary education to 100 million children in the world who don't have any education at all, in Africa, Latin America, the Muslim world, all for 3 billion a year.
If we just promoted sanitation and clean drinking water, things we all take for granted - I have seen firsthand from the work I have done in Africa, how much difference that would make in stopping the spread of disease.
Today, there is an entire generation all around the world sitting on the fence. On one side, there is Bin Laden, Al Qaida, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah, and on the other side is America. Which way do they go?
That depends on us.

On Bush and Cheney:

I listen to George Bush - about as little as I can get away with, but here is what I hear...
Stay home, watch television, go shopping.
me and Dick Cheney, we'll take care of ya'
I don't want that crowd taking care of me!
I don't trust em', that is not America!
We are not a country that cowers in the corner waiting for someone to watch over us. We are strong, we are courageous, we are out there pushing the envelope.
And by the way, when I'm the president of the United States of America, DISSENT WILL ONCE AGAIN BE PATRIOTIC!

Now that sounds like leadership to me. Someone who tells it like it is, whether he is talking to you as an individual, a small crowd, or in front of a national audience.
Not someone showing you one side in person, but really thinking of triangulating to appeal to some neo-con ideology.
We can not afford to pass up this chance to make our candidate answer to we the people.
I for one, have not worked this hard in spite of this administration, just to have a DINO take me and our votes for granted.
That is why I am voting for someone who listens to US! John Edwards for President.

[I edited to include what was in the teaser...Betsy]

Comments

RECOMMENDED!!!

Yup, double posted, but worth it, and a great job.

I would front-page, but we're trying to keep national politics off the front-page unless there's an NC spin, and Edwards being from here is unfortunately not enough of a connection for that.

But you did a great job with this post.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

thanks!

it is a double treat when I come home now, I see the family and get to cover news on Edwards.

wade norris

www.ultimatepoltics.net


"What's the use of a fine house if you haven't got a tolerable planet to put it on?"

Henry David Thoreau

praer.org

That was quite a diary.

It gave me a chance to catch up after a week of craziness.
Thanks!

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

This is exactly what we should be paying attention to

Hillery, becasue she believes it provides marginal safety is doing things which suggest that she will continue many of the Bush policies including Iraq, spying, etc.

The biggest problem is not one persons desire to follow a failed US Ploicy, but the leadership dynamic which will cause many other Democrats to follow suite.

We, (Democratic Party) are making a big mistake with Hillery. She has many Neocon leanings and will, even as Bush has done, further devide the Democratic party which will create an even more extreme dynamic within the party.

John Edwards is being marginalized by the Powerful of the Democratic party. Ultimately we will all regret this action. Wake up America!!...Wake up Democrats!!

For the sake of the country, elect John Edwards.

Marshall Adame
2014 U.S. Congress Candidate NC-03

I think we'll all be surprised

When we find out it's the "powerful" who are being marginalized by the Edwards campaign, and the marginalized who are being given power.

Which is what the Democratic Party is supposed to be about, in my understanding.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Ya know....I don't think Edwards wants to marginalize any group

I think he simply wants to lift up those who don't stand a fighting chance. John Edwards wants to empower those who might otherwise fall through the cracks. Do you know how many in the middle income groups now fall through the cracks? It isn't just the poor who need help. Maybe after 7 long years of agony, I just want to feel hope. In my eyes, a John Edward's presidency is about hope.

Robin Hayes lied. Nobody died, but thousands of folks lost their jobs.



***************************
Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

Every once in a while.....

you mean when I'm not dropping the f-bomb? :)

Robin Hayes lied. Nobody died, but thousands of folks lost their jobs.



***************************
Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

That's exactly what I mean.

Damnit, when you ain't fuckin' around with shitty language, you shure do talk pretty. :)


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

Got hope?

In my eyes, a John Edward's presidency is about hope.

Funny you should say that...
Barack Obama shirt
Left on 49

Hope...hope...hope....where have I heard that before?

So, when you return home some night, you might pass a mother on her way to work the late shift, you tell her: Hope is on the way.

When your brother calls and says he's spending his entire life at the office and he still can't get ahead, you tell him: Hope is on the way.

When your parents call and tell you their medicine's going through the roof, they can't keep up, you tell them: Hope is on the way.

And when your neighbor calls and says her daughter's worked hard and she want's to go to college, you tell her: Hope is on the way.

And when your son or daughter, who is serving this country heroically in Iraq calls, you tell them: Hope is on the way.

Hope is soooooo 2004.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

Gotcha!

Good one.

One of the pitfalls of childhood is that one doesn't have to understand something to feel it. - Carlos Ruiz Zafon

Jesus Swept ticked me off. Too short. I loved the characters and then POOF it was over.
-me

I will delete the duplicate

if there are no objections. I also edited this to include what was in the teaser. I didn't think Wade would mind.

Robin Hayes lied. Nobody died, but thousands of folks lost their jobs.



***************************
Vote Democratic! The ass you save may be your own.

posts like this bother me

I do not mind anyone talking up their favorite candidate, heck that's part of the fun of playing politics.

But I am real tired of otherwise well intentioned dems running down other dems, in this case Clinton.

" ... and why Clinton won't win." Every post that includes this increasingly sketchy prediction makes the Republican's job that much easier.

Here's some Rasmussen polling info that shows Clinton doing very well in four southern states - NC,VA,TN, Ark.

Talk up your guy all you want, just please leave out the Fox "news" talking points.

Person County Democrats

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

polls

bug me.

I want to know who they called. No one ever calls me. I'm more likely to vote than most people.

as for Mrs. Clinton - I will support her should she be the nominee. But until then, I am not impressed.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

I would rather here

that there is a problem with my candidate then go along blindly following a "naked" candidate. That story has a reason. If the best person is to be selected, then that persons strengths as well as weaknesses must be identified.

Strengths made stronger.

Weaknesses corrected or at least shored up.

But to say don't bash is only fooling ourself.

clinton will have a huge problem getting over her lackadaisical attitude with regard to monica and the other women of bill in the whitehouse. she has no integrity or family values. She will have a problem with the constant waffling on the war and her statements of If only i knew then what I know now stance. she cannot show anything she has done that warrants the nation selecting her as president. she should be introducing bills with obama on the floor of the senate showing what she can do now and give us a taste of what is to come. right now, I see someone who is in the top 100 people as far as power and policy goes doing nothing of worth. most of what she is doing anyone with Senator in front of their name could do. She should be rallying the democratic party and driving us in a direction that fixes this country. Is she doing that as a sitting senator?

A lot of the above can be said for Obama also. Obama should be rallying with Clinton and moving us in a direction. Between the two, they can introduce any bill they wish, if they would talk with each other vice fight each other. Where is the solidarity in these two? Many of the things they both want and would implement as president can be introduced now. Where is it? If they cannot communicate with each other and get each other to work in a common direction, how are either one of them going to get GOP bubbas to follow them. As it stands now, if Clinton or Obama are elected pres, we had better have a 60% majority in the senate or nothing is going to get accomplished. Neither of these two have shown me or given me a reason to follow them anywhere.

Edwards is trying to come up with new things.

I didn't get past this.

clinton will have a huge problem getting over her lackadaisical attitude with regard to monica and the other women of bill in the whitehouse. she has no integrity or family values.

No. First - her marriage is her business - not yours, not mine. Second - she kept her family together despite enormous pressure not to. That is what marriage is about - working it out. I don't know how Mr. and Mrs. Clinton kept their marriage together, but they did, and I give them credit for not packing it in when everyone expected them to. That is a lesson in forgiveness and family values no matter what side of the aisle you're on.

I might not vote for Mrs. Clinton in the primary, but you back off of her marriage. It's none of your business.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

That is a fair comment

I do not attack her marriage. I attack her values. She will represent me if she is elected and I hope that the person who represents me will have some of the values I care about.

I lost all respect for bill for what he did to Hillary. I lost a lot of respect for Hillary when she did not dump that poor excuse of a man and husband. For the country, keep the divorce until after he is out of office. Marriage and the vows that go with it mean a lot to me. If she forgave bill for his indiscretions, your right, who am I to question their home or private life. I do not question her home life. What concerns me is if she is this far off on my values why would I want her representing me. How can I believe anything she says is genuine. I cannot or will not. Either one, she will not get my vote. I will vote for snoopy on a write in before I give her my vote. If its a close race and she is in it, I WILL vote for a republican over her.

As the leader of the most powerful nation in the world, I want someone with values that parallel mine.

Hillary is a "professional" politician and nothing more. Clueless to what the plight of the average Joe is. I do not desire someone who has no idea what I do representing me. If she cared for us, she would be bringing bills to the floor with backing from both sides of the senate and from the house as well. She would be getting results vice promising. She has the power right now to implement some of the changes she desires for the good of this country. Why aint she doing it?

I could do just a good a job as Hillary has. The only difference between me and her is she had to money to buy her way into the senate. I do not. If I was a senator, I would have accomplished just as much as she has.

Hillary, based on the things I have observed from her, is not the person that best represents me. Her handling of bill is just the biggest problem I have with her and how others (other world leaders) will perceive this as a weakness. She has presented enough information to me for me to have made a decision on her. My assessment of her is she does not measure up to the standards I have for the President of the United States.

While I do not have a person I endorse, (like it really matters what I think), I have determined who I do not wish to represent me. Hillary is, so far, the only candidate that is on that list.

She will have to appease folks like me if she is to get in the White house.

Just remember ...

I WILL vote for a republican over her.

... that when Guiliani gets to appoint the next 2 supreme court justices, and Roe is overturned, and half of the Bill of Rights gets tossed.

Hillary is a "professional" politician and nothing more. Clueless to what the plight of the average Joe is

.

All 435 members of Congress are professional politicians. Heck, the most professional politician in the country this decade is John Edwards. He's been running for president for 6 years now. How has anything he has done helped your life? His values may be all warm and fuzzy, but they are just words. He has never embraced the task of making them become a reality through hard negotiation and the legislative process. Hillary has been on the reality side of politics for decades.

Do you know anything of Hillary's early life? Teens, 20's and 30's? Or is she just a two dimensional charicature you've allowed the Right wing media to color for you?

She's trying to break through the ultimate glass ceiling. I, for one, can appreciate that that just might make a person rather careful and calculating.

Person County Democrats

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

My charicture of hillary

are based on my observation of her.

What bills has she introduced that has had bi-partisian support and is now law? She has had a while in the Senate to do something.

I will stop this line of thought as I have been here before and I am just rehashing the same issue. I am beating a dead-horse in this case.

Maybe you haven't experienced a deep love for someone

The way I see it, a marriage between two people is not just an agreement, a contract, it's a living thing. It's almost another entity. When my husband and I married, we committed ourselves not just to each other, but to the marriage itself. We nurture it, we make time for it, we take care of it. Since we both went through failed marriages before, we take this very seriously. I don't know if my marriage could survive infidelity. But I give the Clinton's credit for holding their marriage together and remaining a family, especially when they had a young daughter involved.
.

So maybe she'll have to appease you - how? by throwing Bill out now? By saying, I'm sorry, I should have thrown the bastard out? I've still got news for you. It's still none of your business.

As for marriage, the only one you've got any business worrying about is your own, if you have one. As for your vote, you can use it as you see fit, because this is America, after all. People vote for the wrong reasons all the time.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi

I think I follow your train of thought Persondem, but...

it will be Democrats who will decide who is the last Democrat standing for the election process to begin.

In the end of it all, I am sure whomever the choice is at the convention, we will all get behind that person 100%. I know I will!

At that point we will have to close ranks. In doing so we will prevail. If the Democrats prevail, America prevails.

I personally support JE, but whoever walks out of that convention will have my full support.

The Republicans will be facing one, singleminded and organized Democratic Party.

Marshall Adame
2014 U.S. Congress Candidate NC-03

That's the way it should be.

I will back our nominees whomever they may be. I cannot think of a single dem running at any level who I would not support in the general. My enthusiasm might be affected to a degree, but i'll take any of ours over any of thiers. (If Guiliani wins it would be like Montgomery Burns running the country - [cold shiver])

The Republicans will be facing one, singleminded and organized Democratic Party.

This brought to mind that old Will Rogers line - " I am not a menber of any organized political party; I am a Democrat."

I sure hope you are right. :-)

Person County Democrats

I actively oppose gerrymandering. Do you?

Agreed

Democracy is messy. And no matter how rough we are with one another during the primaries, the Replicants will be a thousand times worse. Primaries toughen candidates - and test them.

But when all is said and done, almost any Democrat is infinitely superior to any Republican at any level of government.

We'll all come together well before November 2008. Some of us will be more or less enthusiastic than others, but that's all good. There will be plenty of races to get excited about.

From your lips to God's ears, Marshall.

Or more appropriately, from your keyboard to God's eyes.

The Republicans will be facing one, singleminded and organized Democratic Party.


Be the change you wish to see in the world. --Gandhi